Discussion:
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
(too old to reply)
Boolworm Cowboy
2014-10-29 18:49:19 UTC
Permalink
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.

Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida

Regards,

Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Rene Lamontagne
2014-10-29 18:58:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?

Regards, Rene
sane
2014-10-29 19:44:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
OSX is a mess as far as I am concerned. Finder is a loser. With One
Drive being incorparated by default in 8.1, XBox for gaming that tied
in also and contacts, music, etc., Microsoft has an ecosystem that
works. Apple has a jumble of things that are still hokey.

Linux, depending on flavor is a great OS, with typically much better
file managers that OSX has. You don't have to worry about "bugs" as
much in either Linux or OSX, but after using all of them a great deal
I think Microsoft is ahead of the game at least as far as the package
deal is concerned. Well............Apple has some nice hardware and
the packaging their stuff comes in is really nice.
Silver Slimer
2014-10-29 22:30:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by sane
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
OSX is a mess as far as I am concerned. Finder is a loser. With One
Drive being incorparated by default in 8.1, XBox for gaming that tied
in also and contacts, music, etc., Microsoft has an ecosystem that
works. Apple has a jumble of things that are still hokey.
Linux, depending on flavor is a great OS, with typically much better
file managers that OSX has. You don't have to worry about "bugs" as
much in either Linux or OSX, but after using all of them a great deal
I think Microsoft is ahead of the game at least as far as the package
deal is concerned. Well............Apple has some nice hardware and
the packaging their stuff comes in is really nice.
You don't have to worry about bugs in GNU/Linux? What crack pipe have
you been smoking the stuff from? I have yet to find a single GNU/Linux
program that isn't filled with bugs.

From CD ripping software that crashes if it sees a rather normal
character GNU/Linux doesn't understand to music management software
which claims to have saved your ratings and album art to file without
actually doing so, GNU/Linux has a shitload of software which will
blatantly lie to you and feel no shame in doing so. Screen tearing in 3D
games, a computer which no longer sleeps or wakes, a machine that
refuses to shut down... GNU/Linux has all of that and MORE!
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Boolworm Cowboy
2014-10-29 19:50:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
Really? Why is that? You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale.
So, that's why Windows rules the world; but if Apple lowered the price of their computers, Windows would be toast. They're
cheap and easily accessible; never mind, they're loaded with bugs, and your constantly dealing with viruse and malware
issues. I seldom had to addressed virus or malware issues on my Linux computer, and the operating system never needs to be
reloaded like I occasionally have to do with Windows. Then you have to purchase registry cleaning software, and other
software to keep your Windows computer running smoothly. The other problem is that proprietary software vendors refuse to
support Linux, so you're forced to own a Windows computer if you like it or not. This doesn't change the fact that Windows
8.1 sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay since I'm forced to use it to utilize certain proprietary software.

Regards,

Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Rene Lamontagne
2014-10-29 20:43:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
Really? Why is that? You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale.
So, that's why Windows rules the world; but if Apple lowered the price of their computers, Windows would be toast. They're
cheap and easily accessible; never mind, they're loaded with bugs, and your constantly dealing with viruse and malware
issues. I seldom had to addressed virus or malware issues on my Linux computer, and the operating system never needs to be
reloaded like I occasionally have to do with Windows. Then you have to purchase registry cleaning software, and other
software to keep your Windows computer running smoothly. The other problem is that proprietary software vendors refuse to
support Linux, so you're forced to own a Windows computer if you like it or not. This doesn't change the fact that Windows
8.1 sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay since I'm forced to use it to utilize certain proprietary software.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
No, I do not have to reload windows at all, each version runs fine
for years, One blue screen in the lastb 3 or 4 years, No virusus or
malware, I run protection Software as everyone should.
As for cleaning the registry NEVER, And no I don't use that bogus
software to keep my machine running smoothly, You don't need that junk
if you know how to use a system properly.
LInux? I've tried about 25 distros and none yet has been satisfacory,
It's just not ready for prime time yet.
Windows 8.1 runs quite nicely on my system, It may not be perfect but
it's pretty damned good.
Apple! I gave up on them about 1995 and never looked back.

Regards, Rene
Johnny
2014-10-30 14:02:16 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 15:43:21 -0500
Post by Rene Lamontagne
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 13:58:38 -0500, Rene Lamontagne
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system
blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open
source.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
Really? Why is that? You go to any computer retail outlet, and you
cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale. So,
that's why Windows rules the world; but if Apple lowered the price
of their computers, Windows would be toast. They're cheap and
easily accessible; never mind, they're loaded with bugs, and your
constantly dealing with viruse and malware issues. I seldom had to
addressed virus or malware issues on my Linux computer, and the
operating system never needs to be reloaded like I occasionally
have to do with Windows. Then you have to purchase registry
cleaning software, and other software to keep your Windows computer
running smoothly. The other problem is that proprietary software
vendors refuse to support Linux, so you're forced to own a Windows
computer if you like it or not. This doesn't change the fact that
Windows 8.1 sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay since I'm forced
to use it to utilize certain proprietary software.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
No, I do not have to reload windows at all, each version runs fine
for years, One blue screen in the lastb 3 or 4 years, No virusus or
malware, I run protection Software as everyone should.
As for cleaning the registry NEVER, And no I don't use that bogus
software to keep my machine running smoothly, You don't need that
junk if you know how to use a system properly.
LInux? I've tried about 25 distros and none yet has been satisfacory,
It's just not ready for prime time yet.
Windows 8.1 runs quite nicely on my system, It may not be perfect but
it's pretty damned good.
Apple! I gave up on them about 1995 and never looked back.
Regards, Rene
Linux Mint 17 KDE should work fine for the average computer user. You
don't have to use the Terminal, KDE can be configured from the GUI just
like Windows.

I think what causes most problems for new Linux users is using sudo,
and su in the terminal when it's not necessary, and they change
permissions for folders, and find themselves locked out.

It took the good people in alt.os.linux.mint a few months to pound this
into my head, but since then I no longer have problems with the
operating system. If something strange does happen, I have my home
directory backed up, and can restore it easily.

Personally I wanted to learn to use the Command Line, and have gotten
pretty good at it, but it's not necessary.

For the average user that just wants to use a browser, send and receive
Email, read news groups, shop and bank online, Linux Mint should be as
good as Windows, and is more secure, and Microsoft is not constantly
invading your privacy.
Wolf K
2014-10-30 14:08:17 UTC
Permalink
On 2014-10-30 10:02 AM, Johnny wrote:
[...]
Post by Johnny
For the average user that just wants to use a browser, send and receive
Email, read news groups, shop and bank online, Linux Mint should be as
good as Windows, and is more secure, and Microsoft is not constantly
invading your privacy.
+1

And it will run on older hardware, too. That includes older printers
etc, for which there are no Win8 drivers. OTOH, you may not find Linux
drivers for recent hardware.
--
Best,
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
Bob Henson
2014-10-30 14:34:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
For the average user that just wants to use a browser, send and receive
Email, read news groups, shop and bank online, Linux Mint should be as
good as Windows, and is more secure, and Microsoft is not constantly
invading your privacy.
+1
And it will run on older hardware, too. That includes older printers
etc, for which there are no Win8 drivers. OTOH, you may not find Linux
drivers for recent hardware.
Problems with older hardware show up too. Try running a laptop with a
Broadcom B43 chipset on Mint 9 and getting it to connect to WiFi. Try
getting it to connect to a Wifi Printer. It took me several days to work
out how. Then they changed the Linux kernel to a version which wouldn't
even install on a B43 chipset machine. That took several more days to
fix. Even the latest versions of Mint/Ubuntu have problems connecting
to a Windows network share - it involves changing configuration files
deep in the system where a novice would be totally lost. Everyday
running is fine if you have a version of Linux that is known to run on a
specific machine, you don't ever change anything, and you use
Thunderbird and Firefox (the native Linux e-mail and newsgroup programs
are unusable to a Windows user).

However, it's much better to install Windows 7, 8.1 (or shortly 10) and
have everything just connect first go. Even if you do have to rebuild
the GUI on 8 and 10 with Classic Shell before they are usable.
--
Bob Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK

Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future. - Niels Bohr
Silver Slimer
2014-10-30 16:58:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Henson
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
For the average user that just wants to use a browser, send and receive
Email, read news groups, shop and bank online, Linux Mint should be as
good as Windows, and is more secure, and Microsoft is not constantly
invading your privacy.
+1
And it will run on older hardware, too. That includes older printers
etc, for which there are no Win8 drivers. OTOH, you may not find Linux
drivers for recent hardware.
Problems with older hardware show up too. Try running a laptop with a
Broadcom B43 chipset on Mint 9 and getting it to connect to WiFi. Try
getting it to connect to a Wifi Printer. It took me several days to work
out how. Then they changed the Linux kernel to a version which wouldn't
even install on a B43 chipset machine. That took several more days to
fix. Even the latest versions of Mint/Ubuntu have problems connecting
to a Windows network share - it involves changing configuration files
deep in the system where a novice would be totally lost. Everyday
running is fine if you have a version of Linux that is known to run on a
specific machine, you don't ever change anything, and you use
Thunderbird and Firefox (the native Linux e-mail and newsgroup programs
are unusable to a Windows user).
However, it's much better to install Windows 7, 8.1 (or shortly 10) and
have everything just connect first go. Even if you do have to rebuild
the GUI on 8 and 10 with Classic Shell before they are usable.
I have just this to say. My Windows 7 laptop can connect to a printer
connected to the router very easily. Windows 8.1 tablet and desktop, no
problem. GNU/Linux? No matter what you do, it fails miserably no matter
what the settings are. This printer is four years-old.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-30 15:12:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
For the average user that just wants to use a browser, send and receive
Email, read news groups, shop and bank online, Linux Mint should be as
good as Windows, and is more secure, and Microsoft is not constantly
invading your privacy.
I set up an old PC for a family member with Mint Cinnamon for exactly
that kind of use (and Skype as well), and it performs admirably. It's
so similar to Windows (classic Windows that is, before 8), that nobody
has needed any extra instruction in how to use it. It looks pretty,
and works reliably.

I think the base unit came from a school or college, and cost me
30ukp. It has a quad core AMD processor, 2GB memory and a 160GB disk.
I added a solid state drive for the OS for another 30ukp and kept the
original drive for storage. The monitor was another secondhand item
for about the same price, and I donated an old keyboard and mouse I
already had, so the total cost was less than 100ukp. Considering its
intended use, it simply wasn't worth spending more, especially on an
operating system that would have been more elaborate then necessary
and could even have slowed it down. 64 bit Mint does everything it
needs to do and does it quickly, it took me about 25 minutes of my
time to install, and it cost me nothing.

Rod.
Ken Blake, MVP
2014-10-29 23:41:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
Really? Why is that?
We all have different view about many things, and that's fine; Windows
is one of our differences. I'm not trying to convince you to change
your mind about anything, but I'd like to point out a few things
(mostly for others reading this thread).
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale.
True, but since it's free to download and install Linux, it hardly
matters. It's quick, easy, and free to change from Windows to Linux if
Linux is what you want.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
So, that's why Windows rules the world; but if Apple lowered the price of their computers, Windows would be toast. They're
cheap and easily accessible; never mind, they're loaded with bugs, and your constantly dealing with viruse and malware
issues.
I seldom had to addressed virus or malware issues on my Linux computer,
I have no Linux computer, but I've have *never* had to address a
malware issue (a virus or any other kind of malware) on any Windows
computer. And I've been running almost every version of Windows since
2.0.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
and the operating system never needs to be
reloaded like I occasionally have to do with Windows.
If you did that, it wasn't because you *had* to. It was your choice,
and it's almost always a bad choice. I've never done it.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Then you have to purchase registry cleaning software,
Of all the things you've said, that's the one I most strongly disagree
with. *All* registry cleaning software is nothing but snake oil, and I
always recommend against all of them strongly
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
and other
software to keep your Windows computer running smoothly.
*Other* software? What other software do you have in mind. I use *no*
third-party software to keep Windows running smoothly.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
The other problem is that proprietary software vendors refuse to
support Linux, so you're forced to own a Windows computer if you like it or not.
I use Windows because I like it. If you don't like it, that's fine,
but don't assume that everyone has the same views you do.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
This doesn't change the fact that Windows 8.1 sucks,
That's *your* view. It's not my view, nor is it the view of many other
people I know who use and like it. I think it's fine.
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
but Windows 10 is looking okay since I'm forced to use it to utilize certain proprietary software.
Windows 10 doesn't exist yet. Please don't form any opinions about it
from its technical preview. It may turn out to be very different from
what you think it will be.

What proprietary software are you taking about? I don't know of
anything that will run on the Windows 10 technical preview, but not on
Windows 8.
Ken Springer
2014-10-31 01:09:25 UTC
Permalink
<snip>
Post by Ken Blake, MVP
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale.
True, but since it's free to download and install Linux, it hardly
matters. It's quick, easy, and free to change from Windows to Linux if
Linux is what you want.
But it does make a difference.

1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"

2. The average computer user can't even reinstall Windows (or even OS
X) much of the time, so whey would they attempt to install something
they are unfamiliar with? Even if they do know of/about Linux?

3. The average computer user isn't going do anything about changing
without seeing what the other product looks like. Note that none of us
here are the average computer user.


<snip>
--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 25.0
Thunderbird 24.6.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
Silver Slimer
2014-10-31 01:21:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ken Springer
<snip>
Post by Ken Blake, MVP
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded
Linux computer available for sale.
True, but since it's free to download and install Linux, it hardly
matters. It's quick, easy, and free to change from Windows to Linux if
Linux is what you want.
But it does make a difference.
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
Post by Ken Springer
2. The average computer user can't even reinstall Windows (or even OS
X) much of the time, so whey would they attempt to install something
they are unfamiliar with? Even if they do know of/about Linux?
The only ones who actually would are the more knowledgeable ones who
enjoy tinkering with their machine, fucking it up and eventually
reinstalling Windows.
Post by Ken Springer
3. The average computer user isn't going do anything about changing
without seeing what the other product looks like. Note that none of us
here are the average computer user.
The reality is that in the Windows 9x era, GNU/Linux had a true chance
of stealing Microsoft's thunder by offering a superior, more stable and
prettier operating system to replace the much-abhorred 9x series.
Instead, they offered something a lot less stable which also happened to
be ugly and incredibly inconsistent. Today, GNU/Linux still offers a
less stable, ugly and inconsistent product to compete with very stable
operating systems like Windows 7 & 8 which might not be everyone's cup
of tea as far as looks go but are at least consistent.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-31 09:11:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails,
watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the
grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that,
then in what way is it mediocre?

Rod.
Silver Slimer
2014-10-31 14:24:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web,
Not a problem so long as Flash is a requirement. GNU/Linux doesn't get a
more recent version of Flash than 11.2 unless the user chooses to use
Chrome which includes each new release.
Post by Roderick Stewart
store their snapshots,
Are you referring to photos? Windows and OS X will do a much better job
of this as the process is generally automated through the inclusion of
OneDrive and iCloud software. Both services also provide a plethora of
storage whereas absolutely no GNU/Linux distribution provides cloud
access at all.
Post by Roderick Stewart
send and receive emails,
No problem. GNU/Linux also makes it easier for users to use encryption
in their e-mail communications. Evolution in particular is excellent in
including GnuPG support.
Post by Roderick Stewart
watch YouTube videos,
See Flash.
Post by Roderick Stewart
buy things on Amazon
No problem.
Post by Roderick Stewart
and Skype the
grandchildren,
This is possible so long as Microsoft provides the operating system with
Skype itself. The operating system is basically in a position where if
Microsoft suddenly decides to upgrade the software and block access to
previous versions (as they did with OS X a short while back), that
feature is essentially removed. Microsoft has no reason whatsoever to
cater to the GNUslims.

GNUslims will lead you to believe that it doesn't matter and that
GNU/Linux has excellent Skype alternatives in the event of such an
action. However, that is a complete lie. Jitsi is ridiculous unstable in
every sense of the word and incredibly cumbersome to use despite being
"secure" whereas Ekiga, the long referred-to software, has absolutely no
users and no clients for Windows and OS X anyway.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Steve
2014-10-31 17:33:27 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:11:17 +0000, Roderick Stewart
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails,
watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the
grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that,
then in what way is it mediocre?
Rod.
I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though.
You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why
aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah
We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.One thing I will give
this group is that they are very tolerant. If you talk about Windows
in a Linux group or even use Windows to post, you get told to bugger
off or get called a drooling stooge or something of that nature
Silver Slimer
2014-10-31 16:50:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:11:17 +0000, Roderick Stewart
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails,
watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the
grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that,
then in what way is it mediocre?
Rod.
I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though.
You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why
aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah
We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.One thing I will give
this group is that they are very tolerant. If you talk about Windows
in a Linux group or even use Windows to post, you get told to bugger
off or get called a drooling stooge or something of that nature
Absolutely right, see my signature for classic examples of how I've been
told off for suggesting that I faced problems in GNU/Linux. I have yet
to see people get insulted and bad-mouthed in the Windows groups who
didn't totally deserve it.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Wolf K
2014-10-31 17:17:36 UTC
Permalink
[...] see my signature for classic examples of how I've been told off for
suggesting that I faced problems in GNU/Linux. I have yet to see people
get insulted and bad-mouthed in the Windows groups who didn't totally
deserve it.
Some years ago I tried SuSE, and had a problem: When I tried adding my
wife as a user I somehow wiped out myself, and SuSE became unusable.
Asked for help, but I posted from the Windows side of the machine, of
course. The insults you've quoted are pretty well standard for Lindroid
hate of The Other OS. I hung around a bit, baiting them, but the fun
quickly palled.

Have a good day,
--
Best,
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-31 22:06:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails,
watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the
grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that,
then in what way is it mediocre?
Rod.
I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though.
You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why
aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah
We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.
I suspect you're not really interested in my reasons, so I won't bore
you with them, and they're not relevant to the point I was making
anyway, which is that for many people Linux would do everything they
need, if only they knew.

Rod.
Steve
2014-11-01 01:09:05 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 22:06:16 +0000, Roderick Stewart
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Steve
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap.
And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I
say "Linux", and they say "What's that?"
The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection
of messy amateur code."
If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things
like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails,
watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the
grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that,
then in what way is it mediocre?
Rod.
I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though.
You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why
aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah
We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.
I suspect you're not really interested in my reasons, so I won't bore
you with them, and they're not relevant to the point I was making
anyway, which is that for many people Linux would do everything they
need, if only they knew.
Rod.
Well I know and I'm using windows..I used redhat..then Fedora...back
before there were any live distros. I had ubuntu-mate installed
earlier this week. Seems like there is always a deal breaker though.
This time it was video to dvd convertion..I know there is devede that
produces jumpy videos unless you use deinterlacing..there is bombono
..jumpy too..dvd-styler that is slower than a glacier. It doesn't
matter what the reasons are. Running Linux is like taking a fat girl
to the prom..and she won't even do your homework right
Silver Slimer
2014-11-01 14:26:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve
Well I know and I'm using windows..I used redhat..then Fedora...back
before there were any live distros. I had ubuntu-mate installed
earlier this week. Seems like there is always a deal breaker though.
This time it was video to dvd convertion..I know there is devede that
produces jumpy videos unless you use deinterlacing..there is bombono
..jumpy too..dvd-styler that is slower than a glacier. It doesn't
matter what the reasons are. Running Linux is like taking a fat girl
to the prom..and she won't even do your homework right
I very much agree with you there.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
PAS
2014-10-30 13:08:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
Really? Why is that? You go to any computer retail outlet, and you
cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale.
So, that's why Windows rules the world; but if Apple lowered the price
of their computers, Windows would be toast. They're
cheap and easily accessible; never mind, they're loaded with bugs, and
your constantly dealing with viruse and malware
issues. I seldom had to addressed virus or malware issues on my Linux
computer, and the operating system never needs to be
reloaded like I occasionally have to do with Windows. Then you have to
purchase registry cleaning software, and other
software to keep your Windows computer running smoothly. The other
problem is that proprietary software vendors refuse to
support Linux, so you're forced to own a Windows computer if you like
it or not. This doesn't change the fact that Windows
8.1 sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay since I'm forced to use it
to utilize certain proprietary software.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
If the market demanded Linux then we would see more Linux systems in the
retail chain. The demand simply is not there. Linux is still no match
for the usability of Windows or Mac for the average user.

I can echo pretty much what Rene said. I don't have any issues with
Windows 8.1, nor did I have any with Windows 7. I've not had to reload
my OS, I use Windows security apps and have never got a virus, I don't
use nor do I (or anyone) need a regisrty cleaner, and I do not have any
blue screens tro deal with. I've not had a blue screen using Windows 7
or 8.1 and rarely ever had on with XP, for that matter. I don't think
Windows 8.1 sucks at all, I quite like it and I use it on my desktop
without a touch screen.
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-30 15:16:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by PAS
If the market demanded Linux then we would see more Linux systems in the
retail chain. The demand simply is not there. Linux is still no match
for the usability of Windows or Mac for the average user.
The demand for Linux is not there because the knowledge of its
existence is not there. It's nothing to do with usability.

Rod.
PAS
2014-10-30 15:32:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by PAS
If the market demanded Linux then we would see more Linux systems in the
retail chain. The demand simply is not there. Linux is still no match
for the usability of Windows or Mac for the average user.
The demand for Linux is not there because the knowledge of its
existence is not there. It's nothing to do with usability.
For whatever reason, there is no demand and until there is, there won't
be many systems with Linux installed being sold retail. There is still
a usability issue, as good as it may be, Linux is not as easy to use for
the average user as a Windows system is. Any current printer an average
user will buy will work out-of-the-box on a Windows 7 and 8.1 system.
Is that the case for Linux? Will that use be easily able to share files
on the Windows Homegroup in their home if they have one?
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-30 21:33:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by PAS
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by PAS
If the market demanded Linux then we would see more Linux systems in the
retail chain. The demand simply is not there. Linux is still no match
for the usability of Windows or Mac for the average user.
The demand for Linux is not there because the knowledge of its
existence is not there. It's nothing to do with usability.
For whatever reason, there is no demand and until there is, there won't
be many systems with Linux installed being sold retail. There is still
a usability issue, as good as it may be, Linux is not as easy to use for
the average user as a Windows system is. Any current printer an average
user will buy will work out-of-the-box on a Windows 7 and 8.1 system.
Is that the case for Linux? Will that use be easily able to share files
on the Windows Homegroup in their home if they have one?
I can't speak for everyone, but I've tried out Opensuse, Elementary,
Puppy Linux, Zorin, the entire *buntu family and all the variants of
Linux Mint at one time or other, and possibly a few others I've
forgotten, on at least 3 different PCs, all of which have worked
out-of-the-box with USB printers by Canon and Epson, and network
printers by Dell and Samsung.

The only things that have given me problems have been the wireless
adaptor and the brightness control in an Asus laptop. On a Samsung
netbook, even those things worked without any extra effort. The
wireless adaptors fitted to desktops seem to be OK, and even if they
weren't it would be a simple matter to try a different one. You win
some, you lose some.

Talking of demand, I wonder if there was a demand for a screen full of
tiles before Windows 8 foisted it upon us? Nobody asked for it, we
were given it anyway, and apparently some people actually like it, so
there seems no reason the same couldn't happen with Linux.

Rod.
ray carter
2014-10-29 20:56:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows
Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
Rene Lamontagne
2014-10-29 21:03:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows
Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
WE were talking Computers!!! NOT tractors!


Rene
ray carter
2014-10-30 15:21:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system
blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open
source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
WE were talking Computers!!! NOT tractors!
Rene
So, what is your definition? I would say that a tablet is as much an
appliance as a washing machine. It's also as much a computer as a laptop
or desktop. Your smart phone has more computer power than you could have
had in a desktop 10 years ago.
Jose
2014-10-30 16:23:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system
blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open
source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
WE were talking Computers!!! NOT tractors!
Rene
So, what is your definition? I would say that a tablet is as much an
appliance as a washing machine. It's also as much a computer as a laptop
or desktop. Your smart phone has more computer power than you could have
had in a desktop 10 years ago.

"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""

I had a desktop with 33 MHz processor and 16 MB RAM
Silver Slimer
2014-10-30 17:00:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system
blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open
source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
WE were talking Computers!!! NOT tractors!
Rene
So, what is your definition? I would say that a tablet is as much an
appliance as a washing machine. It's also as much a computer as a laptop
or desktop. Your smart phone has more computer power than you could have
had in a desktop 10 years ago.
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
I had a desktop with 33 MHz processor and 16 MB RAM
It's absolutely remarkable how we get more power out of a phone nowadays
than we could get out of a gigantic computer back then. Things have
changed so drastically and so quickly.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Boolworm Cowboy
2014-10-29 21:06:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows
Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
Yep, I own two Android Tablets myself. I love my Android Tablets, and I have no problems.

Regards,

Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Rene Lamontagne
2014-10-29 21:18:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Post by ray carter
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows
Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
Yep, I own two Android Tablets myself. I love my Android Tablets, and I have no problems.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Me also, Mine is running KitKat 4.4.2 on a 7 inch tablet, Runs great
and I am happy with android on a tablet.
But on a full blown desktop Windosws 8.1 and soon Windows 10 is my choice.

Regards, Rene
Ken Blake, MVP
2014-10-29 23:44:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Post by ray carter
94% of the world's what? Android is the most used system - smart phones,
tablets, all sorts of devices - it's a JVM running on a Linux kernel.
Yep, I own two Android Tablets myself. I love my Android Tablets, and I have no problems.
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Me also, Mine is running KitKat 4.4.2 on a 7 inch tablet, Runs great
and I am happy with android on a tablet.
I also use Android on a tablet. I like my tablet for use when
traveling, but it's no replacement for my desktop.
Post by Rene Lamontagne
But on a full blown desktop Windosws 8.1
Ditto!
Post by Rene Lamontagne
and soon Windows 10 is my choice.
But that's too early for me to say. It's likely that that will also be
my choice, but I'm not willing to say that yet.
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-29 22:56:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.

They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.

Rod.
Ken Blake, MVP
2014-10-29 23:46:04 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 22:56:19 +0000, Roderick Stewart
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Linux is a choice for everyone. It's free, and it's quick and easy to
replace Windows with it.
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-30 10:40:14 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 16:46:04 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
Post by Ken Blake, MVP
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Linux is a choice for everyone. It's free, and it's quick and easy to
replace Windows with it.
But how many people know this? And in any case, how much of a real
choice is it if, before you install Linux, you have to pay for Windows
and then discard it? The choice of a PC with Linux already installed,
or a barebones "blank" PC on which you can install your own, is not
something that is typically offered, or even hinted at, in computer
shops. The reality is that in the high street it's effectively Windows
or nothing. If 94% end up with Windows, this is why. The argument that
it's the result of some superior property of Windows over the
alternatives is specious, because there *are* no alternatives.

Rod.
Ed Propes
2014-11-09 14:35:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roderick Stewart
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 16:46:04 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
Post by Ken Blake, MVP
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Linux is a choice for everyone. It's free, and it's quick and easy to
replace Windows with it.
But how many people know this? And in any case, how much of a real
choice is it if, before you install Linux, you have to pay for Windows
and then discard it? The choice of a PC with Linux already installed,
or a barebones "blank" PC on which you can install your own, is not
something that is typically offered, or even hinted at, in computer
shops. The reality is that in the high street it's effectively Windows
or nothing. If 94% end up with Windows, this is why. The argument that
it's the result of some superior property of Windows over the
alternatives is specious, because there *are* no alternatives.
Rod.
When is the last time that you saw any kind of linux advertised? I
occassionally see articles about linux but that is about it. Windows on
the other hand is a comercial product that has to make a profit. Not
the case with linux so it doesn't get pushed. As long as that is true
it doesn't matter which system is better.
--
Ed Propes
Wolf K
2014-10-30 02:52:57 UTC
Permalink
[...]
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Rod.
For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was
basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea
furniture is too difficult for most people.
--
Best,
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
Gene E. Bloch
2014-10-30 18:03:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Rod.
For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was
basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea
furniture is too difficult for most people.
I'm not so sure that assembling Ikea furniture is easier than building a
computer. I'd almost reverse your sentence above :-)

I've done both successfully and never failed at either, so that's based
on my own experience.
--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
Roderick Stewart
2014-10-30 21:43:47 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 11:03:45 -0700, "Gene E. Bloch"
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Post by Wolf K
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Rod.
For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was
basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea
furniture is too difficult for most people.
I'm not so sure that assembling Ikea furniture is easier than building a
computer. I'd almost reverse your sentence above :-)
I've done both successfully and never failed at either, so that's based
on my own experience.
Funny you should say that. I'm using a home built computer while
sitting at an Ikea table. Even the chair I'm sitting on was supplied
in pieces and had to be assembled. Nothing bad has happened to any of
it yet, so I must have got most of it right.

Rod.
Gene E. Bloch
2014-10-30 23:34:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roderick Stewart
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 11:03:45 -0700, "Gene E. Bloch"
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Post by Wolf K
Post by Roderick Stewart
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
No, that's because most people effectively have no choice.
They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC
yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't
even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready
built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is.
Rod.
For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was
basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea
furniture is too difficult for most people.
I'm not so sure that assembling Ikea furniture is easier than building a
computer. I'd almost reverse your sentence above :-)
I've done both successfully and never failed at either, so that's based
on my own experience.
Funny you should say that. I'm using a home built computer while
sitting at an Ikea table. Even the chair I'm sitting on was supplied
in pieces and had to be assembled. Nothing bad has happened to any of
it yet, so I must have got most of it right.
Rod.
Yeah, but which was easier to put together, the computer or the
furniture?

Just playing - feel free not to answer :-)
--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
Wolf K
2014-10-30 02:45:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Lamontagne
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows?
Regards, Rene
On my blog all-time (last 6 years) visitor OSs are Windows 79%, Linux
10%, OS-X 6%, iPad 1%, all others < 1% each.

Browsers:
Firefox 38%, Internet Explorer 32%, Chrome 14%, Opera 7%, Safari 5%, All
others < 1% each
--
Best,
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.ca
lew
2014-10-29 22:01:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Also have a Mac Mini running OSX 10.10, Yosemite; "sucks"; beginning
to be like/as windows slow. Still problems with tiny system fonts.

My 27" monitor at 2650x1440 is now using 1920x1080 (1080P)
connected via hdmi. Even Safari has problems with tiny system fonts
as the menu looks like the same size that at the 2650x1440 resolution.

Boot up is just as bad with the fake display pretending that things are
work to sucker the user; still have to wait some time before one can
do anything simple like bringing up a browser.

I updated to Yosemite hoping that it allowed the user to enlarge
the system font because crapple came out with their "5k" resolution
monitor.....wonder if the users will be able to see the text without
degrading it to a lower resolution use when reading anything that
uses the system fonts.
Silver Slimer
2014-10-29 22:27:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but
GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each
category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing
it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a
feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all
computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of
Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard
all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days
ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load
3 times slower after the upgrade.

Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux.

OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn
how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple
advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better"
without defining "better." They fall in love rather quickly but very
also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is.
Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and
customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to
have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're
selling.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Ken Springer
2014-10-31 01:45:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but
GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each
category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing
it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a
feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all
computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of
Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard
all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days
ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load
3 times slower after the upgrade.
Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux.
OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn
how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple
advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better"
without defining "better."
You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally
capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work.

I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did
truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month
old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for
a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL

"Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for
the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes
differently.
Post by Silver Slimer
They fall in love rather quickly but very
also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is.
Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and
customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to
have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're
selling.
The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows
generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to
want and appreciate something different.

I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 25.0
Thunderbird 24.6.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
Silver Slimer
2014-10-31 02:02:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but
GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each
category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing
it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a
feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all
computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of
Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard
all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days
ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load
3 times slower after the upgrade.
Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux.
OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn
how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple
advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better"
without defining "better."
You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally
capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work.
I don't. People obviously don't know and don't WANT to know how their
computer works. For those people, Apples are the best product available.
However, I would rather know not only how my computer works but also how
my car and television works so that I can fix it myself if ever it
breaks. Knowledge is not a bad thing... except for Apple users.
Post by Ken Springer
I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did
truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month
old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for
a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL
"Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for
the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes
differently.
Agreed. If you're focused on producing and don't want to be distracted
by figuring out the operation of the computer, a Mac makes sense.
Admittedly.
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Silver Slimer
They fall in love rather quickly but very
also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is.
Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and
customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to
have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're
selling.
The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows
generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to
want and appreciate something different.
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
Oh, I accept it. I appreciate the fact that Apple is constantly pushing
the envelope and forcing PC manufacturers to follow suit. After all, I
get better technology at a lower price and at a higher quality as a
result of that. However, I have no reason to claim anything that isn't
entirely true: Apple users simply aren't technically savvy.
--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia Supporter
www.silverlips.ca

Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates:
- "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than
stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann
- "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper
(http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd)
- "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB
- "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin
- "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride,
apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv
Ken Springer
2014-10-31 02:10:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as
Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but
GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each
category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing
it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a
feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all
computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of
Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard
all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days
ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load
3 times slower after the upgrade.
Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux.
OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn
how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple
advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better"
without defining "better."
You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally
capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work.
I don't. People obviously don't know and don't WANT to know how their
computer works. For those people, Apples are the best product available.
However, I would rather know not only how my computer works but also how
my car and television works so that I can fix it myself if ever it
breaks. Knowledge is not a bad thing... except for Apple users.
And not wanting know also applies to Windows users. And some Apple uses
do want to know how they work.
Post by Silver Slimer
Post by Ken Springer
I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did
truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month
old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for
a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL
"Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for
the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes
differently.
Agreed. If you're focused on producing and don't want to be distracted
by figuring out the operation of the computer, a Mac makes sense.
Admittedly.
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Silver Slimer
They fall in love rather quickly but very
also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is.
Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and
customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to
have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're
selling.
The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows
generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to
want and appreciate something different.
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
Oh, I accept it. I appreciate the fact that Apple is constantly pushing
the envelope and forcing PC manufacturers to follow suit. After all, I
get better technology at a lower price and at a higher quality as a
result of that. However, I have no reason to claim anything that isn't
entirely true: Apple users simply aren't technically savvy.
Once again, depends on the Apple users. I find most Windows users
aren't technically savvy either.

Neither situation makes one OS better than another.
--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 25.0
Thunderbird 24.6.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
Gene E. Bloch
2014-10-31 20:38:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ken Springer
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
That's opportunistic! Dreadful. How could you?

Of course, what I really think is that it's very sensible. Way better
than getting hung up on religious issues.
--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
Ken Springer
2014-11-01 15:04:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Post by Ken Springer
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
That's opportunistic! Dreadful. How could you?
Pretty easily, actually! LOL
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Of course, what I really think is that it's very sensible. Way better
than getting hung up on religious issues.
How true. I've always tended to get the tools that did the job best,
not buy just a particular brand. In this case, software.

Back when I was an active aircraft mechanic, I'd buy the quality tools
that did the job, not by name. I own Snap-On, Mac/Matco (there was a
company shakeup of some kind that split things), and Cornwell (not too
many have heard of them), but no Craftsman.

For those that have been around awhile, you know that years ago,
Craftsman tools took a dive in quality. Warranty remained the same,
quality didn't. We had a new kid fresh out of aircraft mechanics school
that gave everyone grief for spending the $$ of the brands I just
mentioned. Until he went to use his Craftsman wrenches to remove the
cylinders from an engine, and the Craftsman tools were too bulky to fit
in the tight spaces available. He quit buying Craftsman.
--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 25.0
Thunderbird 24.6.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
Gene E. Bloch
2014-11-01 21:47:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Post by Ken Springer
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept
that either.
That's opportunistic! Dreadful. How could you?
Pretty easily, actually! LOL
Post by Gene E. Bloch
Of course, what I really think is that it's very sensible. Way better
than getting hung up on religious issues.
How true. I've always tended to get the tools that did the job best,
not buy just a particular brand. In this case, software.
Back when I was an active aircraft mechanic, I'd buy the quality tools
that did the job, not by name. I own Snap-On, Mac/Matco (there was a
company shakeup of some kind that split things), and Cornwell (not too
many have heard of them), but no Craftsman.
For those that have been around awhile, you know that years ago,
Craftsman tools took a dive in quality. Warranty remained the same,
quality didn't. We had a new kid fresh out of aircraft mechanics school
that gave everyone grief for spending the $$ of the brands I just
mentioned. Until he went to use his Craftsman wrenches to remove the
cylinders from an engine, and the Craftsman tools were too bulky to fit
in the tight spaces available. He quit buying Craftsman.
I'm not a professional mechanic, just someone who does things around the
house, so for me, inexpensive tools are usually adequate, but I still
get bitten on occasion.

My current favorite is the reversible ratchet handle that locks
counterclockwise but not clockwise. I've taken it apart and fixed it,
but it ended up being a temporary fix. Its accompanying sockets are
satisfactory, however, and it's in a nice compact case. Useless but
compact :-)
--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
Big Al
2014-10-29 23:28:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Boolworm Cowboy
Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating
system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source.
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
Regards,
Bookworm Cowboy
Lakeland, Florida
I prefer 8.1 to 10 right now.
Of course I've got a 3rd party menu in 8.1 and not 10, but 10 was
supposed to solve that issue right??? IMHO, Wrong! I can't get both
start menu and start screen without jumping through config changes and
logout.

I like the desktop and startmenu and now and then want the start screen.
Sure, I can go to the apps list in the start menu and pick an app
that will run, but just saying... It's not 100% there for the few
people like me. Even though I could live with 10 as is.
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